Leadership in Sports: 7 Lessons Every Leader Can Use

0:03Welcome to Leadership DNA, a podcast for those who aspire to be a better leader. Alongside Arturo Gomez, I'm Rob Cressy and I'm super excited for this episode because we have a guest. I would like to welcome Trent Clark, CEO at Leadershipity. Trent, great to have you on the show. Great to be here for both of you guys. I'm super excited. So thanks for having me. Trent, I'm gonna go ahead and jump in. I mean, I've known you for a few years now and have been here for a few years.

0:33I had a real pleasure of actually understanding, getting to understand your background. And I mean, it's in the leadership space, it is extensive. So obviously we're excited to have you here today. I mean, it includes multiple World Series championships and, but I'd love to dive in a little bit more about leadershipity right now and try to understand exactly how you're bringing all this experience together to perform and to create the product that you have now. Yeah, thanks.

1:03Yeah, I mean, as the CEO of Leadershipity, we worked with a lot of different organizations, right? A lot of middle market organizations with leadership teams on how do we develop teams of coachable champions. And that's really what we're driving into. And for me, most people didn't go to university to study coaching. They didn't go to study leadership. They didn't go to study management even a lot of times, right? We have high level degrees in engineering.

1:29We have high level degrees in accounting or something to that effect. And now it's like, hey, you've built this great company. That's awesome. Hey, go lead these 400 people. It's like, wait, what? How do I do that well? And so we lean on what we know from the past, what we've been modeled. And of course, with the ities, we talk about integrity, diversity, humanity, accountability, clarity, unity, humility, right? Which we want spirituality, generosity, all those ities we want in all of our leaders. And as you know, like, we have a lot of them. And you guys are two rock stars. And even the rock stars have, you know, some gaps in that, right? Like, well, you know, I don't really like that humility part that much. And so it's like, well, wait a minute. How are you going to lead from there? Right? So that's what we work on. Trent, what I love that you just said there is even rock stars have gaps. And I believe that's actually an extremely important thing that we would all need to be self-aware on because we as leaders, if we believed we were perfect in everything that we do, then that's a fixed mindset.

2:32And I think one of the things that Arturo and I have talked about is the importance of growth mindset, no matter what level you're at. And when you look at the world of sports, even the best of the best, they're always striving to get better every single day. Well, that's, that's, you know, continuous improvement, right? Like it's, it's, it's the Kaizen and everyone's like, Oh, Kaizen, like, you know, Japanese, like we're always going to improve and it's, it's absolutely critical. And, and, you know, in sports. So, so what do we look at today? We've got this whole world turned on its ear. Right. And what's the number one skill we need? Adaptability. We need that right now. Like everybody needs to adapt to what's going on right now without freaking out without everybody going, Oh my gosh, the chicken little, you know, the sky is falling. And that's a, that's a challenge because that's not everybody's DNA. Right. People like to be like, Hey, I like this and I've worked hard to have it this way.

3:28And I don't want it to change. Like, Ooh, you know, changes it's inevitable. It's the, it's the one constant, right? Trent, you said in your opening kind of comments, you said something that for me is it resonated really, it was really impactful. The right now, certainly in the hospitality space, but I think in a lot of industries, there's a huge labor shortage and you have people all over the political spectrum saying it's, it's this side is, uh, you know, we're, we're putting too much money in these guys' hands and they should get off their couch. The way that I've, the way that I've actually been looking at it. And it's, there's some particular instances that I've seen coming out of the good old state of Florida that people are saying, Hey, you know, these employees don't want to come to work. My, my actually thought was, and there's, there's companies right now that are incentivizing hourly, uh, employees to come on board. What I've not seen is any company, any corporation publicly acknowledge that they're investing in their leaders to create a culture that becomes a lot more magnetic than Joe's bar and grill on the corner. Instead of complaining that you can't get employees, focus on what could potentially be a problem. And it may be is your culture. Maybe it's your leadership. Maybe it's that you're not attractive enough for these individuals that now are they're fighting and they're going against the Amazons of the world. And some of these other big industry, these industry giants that are putting a strong emphasis on development, coaching, culture, mentorship, you know? So if you can maybe kind of speak a little about that, well, I think it's a huge point, Arturo. I think you know, you kind of nailed it. Like, why aren't we investing in this right now? Like I could tell you like our companies that work with leadershipity, I've had 60% of our companies double down in 2020 on engagement. Now that's a pretty easy deal in a lot of ways because it's like, Hey, what was our T and E budget last year? You know, Oh, a million dollars. And, and 2020, it was 90, 92 grand. So all of a sudden they're like, Hey, we got $900,000. Let's upskill. Let's go get going and get some of the high quality talent because some people have been under no fault of their own. They've been let go. They're all of a sudden they're on their bench and you got some high quality talent on that bench and they won't sit there long. And the folks who are looking like, Hey, we're going to go upskill right now. We're going to go get better. And we just, you know, companies around us, we're, we're growing leadershipity companies are growing. They're hitting it hard. They're up, you know, I got one coming up like, you know, 40%. Like it's, it's no joke. People can go and grab top talent. They can, it's also a good time to prune a little bit. People that are struggling to be a part of the culture right now and are fighting that like, Hey, listen, maybe there's a better opportunity for you. Cause it might not be here. We're going to keep moving forward and keep driving. And for those that are challenged and distracted by all the other things we're, we're, back to I think Henry Ford said it, you know, Hey, obstacles are those things you see when you take your eyes off your goals. If we're focused on what I need to do, then we're, we're kind of moving forward. And I think part of that unemployment option, Arturo was like, are we giving people purpose? Are we giving them like places they're going to be successful? You know, I love Bill Belichick's quote on this, where he says, Hey, I know I got a great team when everybody in the whole organization knows what they need to do. And they're doing it. Like, you know how many organizations I go in and go, Hey, you know, what are you supposed to be doing today, Trish? And she's like, I don't know. I asked my boss every day and they kind of give me a direction. Like, wait, even here three years and every day I go in and check in with someone on what I should do. We don't know and own our own roles and responsibilities. Like that's bonkers, right? That's inefficiency, like 400 level. And we're not giving these people and enabling them the tools to really move forward. But the good organizations, they're hiring the talent. They're getting them in place. They're letting them, you know, certainly autonomous environment more than ever with the remote learning, like go home and kill it. Like these are what you're responsible for. And you will be judged against those responsibilities and you need to take ownership in that. Trent, I want to dig deeper into the culture side of things. Us being in Chicago, we saw the way that Joe Maddon and the Cubs won a world series. And you're like, well, what happened there? Well, one, Joe Maddon brought a culture with him, this way of doing things. And when you look across the board, you mentioned that the Patriots, they were successful. The San Antonio Spurs, they've been successful. The Pittsburgh Steelers, they've been successful. It's because they've got this culture of excellence in winning. And it blows my mind when you see at the highest level of professional sports, when teams and organizations consistently do not succeed because of the culture or a lack thereof. So it's like, all right, what can be done to start to build the foundation of a good culture? And we know it starts at the top, but what are some of your thoughts from what you've experienced from what great leaders do to establish a culture of excellence? Yeah, I think it's, it's gigantic, right? The first thing you said, I've worked with a couple of really good ones, right? With Joe, you know, Joe and I were together seven years with the Angels and he set standards, right? Nick Saban, when I was with him, like he sets a standard and it's, it's a moonshot, right? Like, it's like, Hey, Rob, come work with me and come to the moon with me. Right. And you're like, Oh my gosh. All right, let's do it. And then like, you do everything in your power. Like, Oh, you know, Rob didn't reach the moon. I mean, he meets, he reached the highest star and you know, you made 25 million a year, but you know, like he was a little short of the moon. You're like, yeah, but the people who dropped out were like, Oh my gosh, it's just too hard. That standard is too high. They were eliminating themselves in a lot of ways. Right. And so, you know, when you have that's the first thing I tell leaders, like set a high bar, because if you set a low bar, people are unlikely to go get it. It might exceed it a little bit, but they're not going to go, you know, this bar is that they're not going to stay. What they're going to go to is like, Oh, Trent, that was a nice bar. You know what I'm going to do? I'm running over to Arturo's group where he's got a high bar because I need to be challenged. And Arturo sets the standard. I'm going over to Cressy's group where they kick some butt, you know, like, cause you're not challenging me anymore. And so if you want the, those stars, I think you got to set that. And they were so good about that. And Joe's got a superpower of absolutely taking his people and maximizing, you know, their potential, right? He's so good at this. He takes these young athletes and he says, Hey, this is, this is what you're great at. What a lot of people probably don't understand in pro sports and a lot of things is that, you know, we don't really work that much on the weaknesses.

10:38The strengths are so great. Like the strengths are such a superpower. Like I'm going to do this until Rob, you can stop me. And I don't think you can. So let's do, and you're doing the same thing. Like, you know what? I don't think you can hit this. So I'm going to be throwing this at you until you prove you could actually do it. And, and so I think there's this ability to prove. And then the other thing that he does so great is like, when he sees you develop those superpowers, he puts you in that role. And he's like, Chris, he's got this, these two things. So I'm going to let him catch, play this position. He will always be successful. But for Arturo, he's going to be successful over there. He's a speed guy. We have him over at, you know, center field. We want this. And we put him in a position always to be successful in situations where he knows the mentality of folks. He gets to know them very well. I just wrote, I just did a piece on this the other day on Monday morning motivation for us. I'm here in Phoenix and I did it over in front of the Cubs spring training facility. And that is Joe's deal. It's like, he absolutely gets to know people and their abilities, their mentalities, what they can handle. And as you, as you all remember in the series in the year they won, I was sitting in a bar and they were all saying like, Oh my gosh, I can't believe they're leaving the clothes are out there. Like Joe's been with this kid for 120 days or 140 days in a row. Like he knows exactly what he's capable of. Like he's not going to put somebody out there and go, well, I hope he's successful. Like he knows what he has an ability of. And, and everyone points to that on Brady. That mentality is no joke. When they took him in the draft, like sixth round, they knew they had a guy who could win in the fourth quarter. Cause he proved it how many times in college at Michigan, he did it again. And again, like when it's on the line, all of a sudden Brady looks like a superpower. He just doesn't look good on the combine when he takes his shirt off. Right. But like in the fourth quarter, when I need him, he's a rockstar. That's amazing. So Trent, when did you, um, I mean, cause your, your history, I mean, working with athletes specializing really in the, in the physical side, at what point in your career did you say, you know, I may continue on the physical side, but I really need to get into the mental side and the emotional side. When did you, when did you make that jump? And, and tell me about how understanding that side has made you that much more talented and impacting people. Yeah, I think it's a, wow. That's a, that's a pretty deep question right there. And I think it's part of the self-reflection, right? I think, you know, both of you guys have met me. I am not looking the prototypical major league baseball, right at five, six, 170 pounds. So, you know, I think the mentality of the grit, you know, that grit formula, I love that so much to understand people's willingness, uh, and effort that they're willing to put forward. Uh, and so when I got into pro baseball here, I was this guy that was always willing to go the extra mile. Right.

13:42And so, um, with that, sorry about that, excuse me. And so with that, um, I think that that became part of understanding that mentality. We all, we, I was interviewing a guy, a good friend of mine, a mentor and coach. He said, you know, don't, don't be willing to go the extra mile, like build your house on it. And I was like, Oh man, that's, that's, that was powerful stuff to me.

14:07As I think about the mentality that like says, Hey, I will, who's, well, who's going to do that? Arturo, Rob, who do you think we can get around here? And someone, Arturo goes, I will, I will do it. Like the person who's willing to step up. And I think about like people like you two guys and other folks that I've known and who've been super successful. And I think about, they've always gone the extra mile for people, for their organization, for themselves, for their families.

14:35And by the way, I've also been to all their houses. Like it's like 7,000 square foot with a pool and a hoop court in the back. Like, like I noticed all those houses on the extra mile are pretty nice. Right. Like if you really want to go the extra mile. And so when he said that, like, Hey, don't go the extra mile, build your house on it. I just thought, man, there's a mentality that comes into that for somebody. When, when I got into sports, I was this guy who had an exercise science degree, training athletes physically, but very quickly I realized that, man, I needed a psychology degree. People were coming in after the ball games and they're, they're digesting this mentality of, you know, I was three for four and hit two home runs. And, you know, I'm strutting through the weight room, you know, now it's the gun show. I don't know if you've seen me recently, right. You know, or it's, I struck out three or four times.

15:26The body language has changed three strikeouts and four at bats. I can't hit water. If I fell out of a boat, you can, you can feel the negative self-talk that's coming at people. And it's like, whoa, man, like here, I gotta, I gotta get in and get and build this guy up. This guy, I gotta bring down because, you know, confidence is moving into arrogance and you're like, Hey man, let me, let me pull you back. You know, I got a, I got a cake. I got a humble pie over in the office.

15:53I'm going to give you a slice. Right. And then I got this other guy who it's like, Oh my goodness, man. Like, no, no, you got this. Like, this is, this is one day that will be another day. Right. And I loved your piece that you guys did a couple of weeks ago on, you know, that one day. Right. I love that because I'm a, I'm a believer in that proponent. So Trent, you just mentioned two extremely unique, but valuable things in self-talk and grit.

16:21And there are such big key performance indicators for future success because what we say to ourselves and what we vocalize, it's what is going to happen. That's why you see so much in the world of affirmations. Anyone who watched the UFC event this past weekend, and one of the girls who had just an, just an incredible knockout right before she stepped into the cage, she says, I am the best.

16:47And it made me feel so good as someone who's a master of language to see that on the highest level. But then we talk about the grit side of things. And it's the people who are willing to not only just go the extra mile, but do the things that others aren't willing to do in both of these things. While simple can be extremely difficult for people to grasp because it's an everyday thing that every time a new challenge comes, we have the opportunity to say, am I going to let the bitch voice in me say, Rob, don't go and do it? Or am I going to push forward and say, you know what, you need to get to the gym and do these extra reps? Or what is this self-talk I'm going to have when I have a bad day or I go over three? So how do you find is a good way for people to work on these things? And certainly as you get higher up, you're dealing with the best people in the world who are struggling with their self-talk. How do you help them with self-talk and grittiness? Well, I think it's all the things that you guys teach on your show. I mean, I think you guys are hitting it right on. I mean, I've listened to a couple episodes and you guys are just dead on with it. Like one is, you know, get a coach, right? Get somebody around you, who you surround yourselves is so important. I know you guys have touched on that a number of times. I mean, it's also writing down your goals, writing that down and getting a visual of that.

18:08And, and I love that one day that you guys talked about a couple episodes ago. Cause for me, it's this day for that day. Right. I was taught that a while back, like, Hey, on that day, you know, we're going to have, you know, our tour is coming is going to be a hundred million dollars on that day. But what are we doing this day to get to there? Right. Like that's not that far away. It may be two years, maybe three years, but like it's this day. What are we doing this day for that day?

18:34And, you know, for me, it was that, you know, college scholarship, right? What am I doing this day to get that college scholarship? And I was a man, self-talk guy. I was like, I think I can, I think I can. And I often tell the story when I'm speaking about seeing Steve Avery for the first time, you know, we were kids growing up in the same state in Michigan. And Steve was a left-hander throwing 90 miles an hour at 16 years old. Right. And he was desk. He's a great athlete. Like he's destined for superstardom. And of course he was with the Braves for a long time. And, you know, I can just remember like, so for example, what we tell ourselves, you know, I sat down with a buddy of mine. We knew it was a big day because you got, you know, 12 scouts are going to be there to watch Steve the next day. And fortunately for us, they got to watch the whole game. And I'm like, as a little guy, I'm like, man, I gotta, I gotta make an impression on someone. I'm like, my buddy goes, man, it's a big game. And Avery's going to strike me out four times. And I'm like, you know, he's not going to strike me out four times. Like I'm going to hit one right back at his lid, man. You watch this all false confidence. Right. I am hope. Like I'm still hope is a strategy at this point. Right. But I'm, but I'm telling myself, you know, I think I can. And, and I'm like, and I get in the box, man. And I'm like, here we go, man. I want some of this. Like I'm ready. And I mean, whack that first pitch comes in and I'm like, I didn't see it. Like, that's like, it was like a BB. Like I'm like, what? So I'm like, I step out, I take a breath, trying not to look fully panic. Like, Holy crap. What am I going to do here? Right. I'm thinking quick, quick. Just got to be fast. Fortunately, little guy, I'm sure Steve's thinking I'll just blow this guy out of the water. I do quicken up. Thankfully, Steve hits my bat and you know, I go quick and a line drive right back at his head, like right over his head, about a foot in the center field for a base. I forget to run. I'm so surprised myself. Right. Oh, I got to go to first. I got to, you know, so I ended up getting two hits that day, lose the ball game three to one. I score one run and two of those scouts call my dad and say, Hey, what's Trent's plans. Right. So now I'm on the radar. Right. But, but it started days and years before that. Like I need moments to show I can do it. And it's this day for that day. What are you doing this day? If I'm not in the weight room, if I'm not hitting the T, if I'm not getting the reps, I'm not there that day when it absolutely needs me. And it's what we love about Brady. Right. Like he's the epitome of wooden is like, be your best when your best is needed. Like every time Brady's needs, like Roger Federer, another guy, like every time his best is needed, the guy's like incredible. Right. It's like, man, you know, you ever see a guy just choke in the big tournament or a person who's got their big moment and they just can't bring it in. Like this guy absolutely surpasses the big moment and plays one of the best. That's incredible to me, right? These guys that can do it. It's a, that's a mentality that wasn't built in a moment. It's built time and time again, day by day, hour by hour, moment by moment. Awesome. Trent, I got a, I got a, I got a question for you. So, you know, we kind of touched on it a little bit before we started recording, but you know, COVID has changed a lot. COVID has flipped the, really the entire world upside down. Has that changed anything in terms of the way that people view leadership? And is there a specific quality that you think now kind of stands alone as one of those things that's going to be a leadership quality that people are going to be looking for and trying to cultivate in future leaders? Yeah, I think that now more than everything, you know, I think it's still the same quality that has always been there, but now I think it's even more heightened, which is for me, it's, you know, personal discipline, right? It's the, it's the absolute discipline to do what's needed of you when it's needed. And it's just a tough thing, right? We're human nature. And like you guys said, I'm a strength coach in baseball. And I work out guys from, you know, 9am to 11. I go to the ballpark at one and then I work out people till midnight and then I go home. So when does Trent do his workout, right? I got to do it at 630 in the morning or I got to stay late. And man, the times that on a travel day, I just want to get to the hotel and watch a movie and eat bonbons and order room service. Like I'm still the same guy. Like I got human nature sets in on, I'm tired, man, from the road and worn down and I don't want to go do it. And it takes that personal discipline to do hard things. And the folks that have that, I think, separate themselves from everybody pretty quickly. You know, you guys talk about this formula for sex, for success. And, and I've seen elite performers my whole life. I've spent my whole life around them, my whole adult life. And the formula is absolutely simple. It's absolutely simple. It's just not easy. Right? Like it's not, it's not rocket science, like hard effort and grinding and grit, like focus on what you need to do, getting the right people around you that continue developing, having that personal discipline. Like none of it is, is so complex, but if people think that's easy on a day to day basis, it's not easy. One of the quotes that I love that I live by is prepare for what's difficult when it's easy. And as I look through the pandemic, I really saw it for myself as a crucible of adversity that was going to set me up for the rest of my life for success. Because when everybody else is running and going backwards, remember, we're all going through the same days every single day. What am I going to do to separate myself? And I've had to transform myself to say, all right, those times in which I don't want to do something, those end up becoming the most valuable moments for you. So exactly like you said, Trent, you're on this road trip. All you want to do is sit there and have room service. But you know, when you're done with that workout, man, what it does to your mind from the way that I see things. And certainly I think fitness is a great example for everyone because it's something that is a part of success in general health. And it's an easy thing to say, I'm not going to do it today, but I do, I do fitness for my mind because the number of times times that I don't want to go is all the time. And, and I've worked out four to five days a week for the last 15 years. So I'm extremely consistent with it. And when you're operating at that level, it's like, Oh, it must be easy for you. No, it is never easy. Just like waking up in the morning in the fives. Never easy for me. You wake up and you're like, Oh my God, I would love, but you start to learn that that's actually where for me, my confidence comes from because last week I did a leg day when I didn't even want to go to the gym and my legs were hurting the next day. And I was like, I earned that confidence. Can you talk about earned confidence? Because for me, it is what grit and personal discipline and accountability. And that to me is how you transform yourself into a leader.

26:19And that's what is helping build culture. Yeah. That's that one right there. Right. Like earned, not given, right? Like nothing's given in this life. And I, that's the travesty that I think we're missing with our youth is like, you got to earn it. And have you ever been to, um, have you ever, when you ever did that workout, right? Like, have you ever done it and then gone, man, I'm so unhappy with myself that I just spent an hour and 15 minutes of the gym getting better. Like when you're done, you're like, yeah, like I didn't want to do this at all. But like, and the next day when you feel that soreness, like, yes, I did something. And, and, you know, this is, this is so crucial for us because that, that soreness is telling us, it's giving us feedback, like you're growing. Right. And you talk about that growth mindset. We do, um, uh, what we do three sixties with a lot of leaders. And if you're not familiar with the three 60, it's surrounding yourself with 20 people that are close to you from direct reports to peers, to superiors, to vendors or clients. And so you get different lenses in and they all rate you of how do you see you as a leader? And I'm like, Oh, well, I see me as a great leader. I see me as a super listener. I'm a 90 and everyone goes, yeah, 50, you suck. You need to, you know, like, and I'm like, Oh, what? Like, and like, so the whole perception is I'm a 50 and I think I'm a 90. We got massive gap here. Right. Like I got to shore up that gap. Like, and now I've got all this feedback because perception's reality. Right. I can sit there and say, Hey, if I'm a 90 and they think I'm a 50, well, what's true. Well, the 50 is true. Perception is reality. It's what everyone sees and believes. Not, not what I think. Cause you know, we judge ourselves on our, on our intentions. We judge others on their actions. So it's like, Oh man, I intended to work out like, wow. Oh, look at this person, you know, overweight, not working out. Like, I mean, I'm not doing it, but you know, I've talked about it all the time and I've got the weight room at home too. Like, wait, wait, I intend to work out. I don't do it, but like, now I'm going to start judging other people. Like, yes, that's not great for us. Right. So when we talk about that grind, man, it's, it's, it's a lot about that self-awareness and that leadership, man, it's, it's, you know, I tell people a lot, like when they talk about leadership, you sure? Like, here's what I really want. Are you sure? Like, because right now it is tough. It's tough out there. And it's 24 seven, which I think is very different from, you know, even 20, 30 years ago with a social media, you post something, you know, people taking a camera. I know Rob Cressy, he's got a big profile, like this and that. And all of a sudden they got, you know, you talking to some clerk at a grocery store, like not, not in your best light at 1130, looking for something for your wife upset. You got a sick kid and someone takes a video shot of you and going, Oh, this is Cressy. Arturo's getting on a plane, you know, with one of his luxury aviation company. And all of a sudden he's going to start mistreating people. People are going to be like, there's a, there's a camera on that at 3am in the middle of Barcelona, Spain. And Hey man, you were always on. And, you know, for people who don't understand that it. And so if you don't have any self-awareness around that right now, this is, this is going to be tough for you because I think it's actually strengthened us as people in a lot of ways, because we closed the gap on the imposter because it's not like, you know what? I go fool everybody from nine to five. And then I come home and I'm a total, you know, bonehead, but man, nine to five, I got them fooled. And I think I can keep this up for about 15 more years. Like, you know, we all live in that imposter sometimes, but like we've been forced into recognition where our gaps are. We got to understand. And the reality is that, you know, as we talk about these teams in that, in that mentality, like understand, like, you know, I don't have to be great at that because I've got Rob and Arturo on my team. So like when I, when I'm faced with this, I go, Oh, you know what? I don't know. Arturo, what do you think? Can you run point on this? Because you're a superstar at this. Let's put you in the position to be better for our organization. Because if I'm in the position, I'm going to mock it up. And if Arturo is in the position, we're going to go better. And when Rob's time to shine, we've got to put him out front, you know? And I think that's just the critical element as leaders. We got to understand and be okay with the fact that you're not going to be great at everything. Right. You know, I have a, I, there's a quote that I saw. It was actually from the Harvard business review, something that actually resonates immensely with me because I've been a real faith guy in terms of when I've been coaching and mentoring, I see things in certain people that they may not have the resume. They may not have the experience of the background, but there's some intangible, there's something about that person that I know that they're going to be special. And this quote, this article is hire leaders for what they can do, not for what they've done. So the reason I bring it up in this conversation is one, because I know that you have this crazy deep sports background and it really kind of reads like a scouting report. It's like, Hey, this kid, you know what? He may have only played ball at one year or two years in high school, but there's something about his physical or his presence on the field that tells me that he's a Tom Brady, right? Yeah. You know, so, um, you know, so can you speak to that? And is that something that you've seen over your years? And like, Yes. I mean, I, you, you just nailed it right there with, uh, just, I smile because it takes me back to a moment of how long we've been measuring the wrong things. Right. And how many times in baseball I heard, like, you know, you got somebody right now talking to us and going, Hey, Rob, our trail, what do you think of this guy? He was really great in 2011. Wait, what did you just say 2011? Like it, that was 10 years ago. He won 20 games or we, are we, he's, he's 37 now. Like we're, we're not talking about the same guy anymore. Like the physical attributes have all changed. And I hear stuff in the mentality of that. And it drives me bonkers. And I think that's why everybody loves Moneyball. Right. Because Paul DePodesta was a guy that I was with in Cleveland. He's the Harvard guy. That's kind of based on that with Oakland who, um, the actor, you know, plays there and, um, you know, Paul's not with the Browns and look what the Browns are doing. He's changing the way they see potential. He's changing the way they start measuring success and what makes, what means talent. And, and I think, you know, we're back to, you know, what got you here won't get you there. Right. We got to keep adapting. We got to keep, you know, materializing new proponent, be looking for success in different ways. And we have to be aware of who can take us into that and who has that mentality to adapt and change and continue to progress. And that's crucial. And I think, uh, you know, and I tell a great story about Paul, we had an open tryout. This is years ago with the Indians. This is like, I was like 25 or 26 years old.

33:37And, and you remember, and they still do it by the way, professional baseball, they run the 60 for a measurement and like, Oh, you know, Rob Crest is coming in. He's got a great 60. And I'm like, well, that's awesome. But like, I don't know if that's what we need to be measuring. Like, I want to know mass times acceleration, right? Because that produces force. And so I want to know how big he is and how fast he can move in 10 yards. So I would set up my digital timers for 60.

34:05And then I would set up 40 because there was a ton of data on that out of the combines and everything else. And then I would stand at 10 and take all the numbers because when I was in Detroit, like I was with the Tigers in 94 with Sparky Anderson, Kirk Gibson, Cecil Fielder, a bunch of great guys. And I would run 10 yard sprints and Cecil Fielder could run with Kirk Gibson, all American flanker, you know, world champion, Kirk Gibson, who's an absolute stud. Right. And I've got overweight to 55, maybe on two years ago scale. And, and in 10 yards, man, like he was right there with Gibson. And I'm like going, maybe this is why he hits the ball 520 feet because he can absolutely create this guy. If he would have been in football, he probably would have been, you know, an all American defensive tackle or pulling guard or something. This guy could absolutely get out. Now in a 40, he's going to lose by 10 yards to Gibson. Right. Like it's not the same, but like quickness, like he's got it. And are we, are we looking for the right things in people? Arturo? Like when you say that, like when we're looking for the potential, what are the qualities we need in that? And so I think that's a really key component for organizations to identify in their leaders, like what do we need and start looking for the right things as opposed to what everybody tells us we should be looking for. Right. So Trent, as we wrap this up, what Arturo and I like to do is give an action item or a takeaway from the episode for everyone listening and watching. And for me, it actually goes to one word, my takeaway. And it comes from something you said about investing in leaders to create a magnetic culture. And you said the word upskill. For me, it is so important as leaders, both for ourselves, personal leaders and leaders of teams that we are constantly leveling up our skills and doing the same for your team. Because when you can create a culture of constantly learning and that starts at the top, that is how you create something absolutely magical. So Arturo, I'll give it to you before we drop it to Trent. What is your action item or takeaway? I think, I think for me, anybody that, you know, this is for aspiring leaders and individuals that feel like they're already in a strong leadership position. I don't think that there's a day that we can spend with, without getting value and looking back on our culture and actually writing things down that we feel are our strengths and our, and our gaps and our weaknesses. I think culture is, you know, there's a bunch of different sayings about how culture eats strategy or what, I forgot what the exact comment is, but it's we, if we really focused in on the culture of who we are as organizations and what we can contribute to the human level, I think that our organizations would be much better off and in stronger positions. And so spend some time, spend some time and write down your, you know, your core values, write down what you're trying to do as an organization, but not as a, not as a fiscal goal. Talk, talk to yourself and write down what you're trying to do on a human level. Yeah. That was the Peter Drucker culture eats strategy for breakfast. Right. And I love that. And, and I think there's a lot of truth to that. You know, for me, I'm a, I'm a Hebrews 12:11 guy, like no discipline seems pleasurable, you know, no discipline is pleasure at the time, but often painful later on. However, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those that have been trained by it. Like we've got to go do the training of discipline. It's not easy, but like, we've never looked back. And when we look at our young careers and the hard things, the, the stay up all night for the final exam, you don't ever regret that because you got the degree. You don't ever regret the hill running because your team won the championship, you know, the hard workouts puking over the barrel. No one ever does. Those are, those are acute pain. They're short term pains. Discipline is short term. Regret is chronic pain. That is, you do not want to be in the regret pain side. So for me, I think that's critical for me to take away on, you know, upskilling and, and culture, I should probably get paid by these guys, but you know, Blinkist is probably one of the best tools for leaders. Um, you know, books in 15 minutes audible or written, you know, if you highlight anything out of it can sync to Evernote. You can have a ton of information and data in a very short period. You can build a library of power, intelligence, education, you know, things you can build and continue to work on upskilling and your culture and all those things. And it's all like handheld and easy. We talk about leaders reading 50 books a year. That's a very difficult thing. It's a tough discipline, but there are a lot of tools now we can get our education very quickly. And what we know, the three of us is we've got a bunch of storied histories from our experiences. So reading a great book by Stephen Covey, I don't, I don't need to hear the Stephen Covey and his family story. I'd rather apply the data to my stories. I want to get the message and bring it into my stories. And so I think, I think Blinkist is a real active. So for a powerful tool for folks, Rob, I'd really recommend people engage there and be smart. Trent, really enjoyed jamming with you and all the knowledge and inspiration that you shared with us.

Transcript cleaned up for reading. Sign-off trimmed.

0:03Welcome to Leadership DNA, a podcast for those who aspire to be a better leader. Alongside Arturo Gomez, I'm Rob Cressy. And Arturo, I am super excited for today's show because we have a guest coming on. Yes. So, if you want me to start talking, my name is Jose Morales and I am blessed to be on this Leadership DNA podcast with Arturo and Rob.

0:32I just want to say thank you guys for inviting me and thank you for thinking of me and thinking I belong with you guys. It's a blessing. And FYI, Rob is a guy who got me into podcasts. So, that's another thing I want to say. Thank you. On the record, my man Rob, thank you for opening that door to me. You are welcome, Jose. And I love how you've taken it and run with it and used it as a positive force for good in the world, both for the building of your brand, but also in highlighting other stories in the way that people have gone through life and made things happen. I knew there was so much potential in you and certainly if anyone checks you out on social media, they'll see the content that you create. And the reason why I wanted to have you on the show today is to talk about boxing leadership because you own the Jose Morales boxing academy.

1:28And when I see the content that you create and the way that you lead young fighters and the way that you lead yourself and the way that you've transformed yourself from a boxer to a coach in the building of your business. One, it inspires me. Two, there's so many lessons in there. And three, I want to dig deeper into some of the thought processes around leadership because I really believe it can help others who are listening to our show.

1:56Cool. Let's do it. That was a great topic. You definitely picked, like I said earlier, man, that's my cup of tea. Leadership, boxing, podcast, man, let's do it. Let's go. So here's the first question that I have in Arturo. Here's what we will do. Let's go back and forth. I can ask a question. You can jump in there so we can do a little ping pong here.

2:16And Jose, it actually comes from one of your Instagram posts in the last week where you talked about confidence. And I think confidence as a leader is so important. Certainly when times are tough, which welcome to boxing, not everything's going to be puppy dogs and rainbows. But can you share a little bit more about your mindset around confidence? Because all great leaders, they're confident.

2:41Yeah. Man, that's a good question because I actually preach this every single day. So the question there, it's I can go on and on and on, but I'm going to answer it with my mindset and with me. I always actually I'm blessed that I've always been super confident in myself my whole life. So I think that's probably one of those things that I was God just blessed me with.

3:08But now as a leader and as a boxing coach, now I have to help my staff be confident in themselves and what they're doing in whatever role they're playing. And then I also have to have these people that are walking through my door be confident enough to feel like they belong to be here first and then belong to stay here, meaning that they're growing, that they're getting better.

3:32And then my people that are competing, my boxers, they have to feel confident that they can do damage with their hands. When they have somebody that may look tougher, may look like they on social media is one of those big things right now that social media, you'll see somebody and you feel like, man, that guy's really good when he's in the mids or when he's training.

3:55And you can kind of psych yourself out. So as a coach, I have to really make sure I maintain them away from any negative thoughts that they start questioning themselves. Because as soon as you start questioning yourself, anything, whatever it is, you're questioning yourself. That means you have a little bit of doubt in your mind. And that little bit of doubt, no matter if it's a little bit or a lot, any doubt in your mind is no good at all.

4:21It needs to get out of there. So that's one of those things that I have to try to keep them away from any negative thoughts, any doubters or anything like that. And keep them focused on their mission and whatever mission they may be. I mean, whatever that mission may be. Talking to them constantly is one of the biggest things that I do with them. But with me is talking to myself in my mind. I'm constantly talking to myself in a good way.

4:49Like I said on the Instagram post, I constantly say good things to myself. And even if I wear an ugly shirt, even if it's an ugly shirt, I still make myself believe it's a great shirt. You know what I mean? And little things like that, which help my confidence so that I can help their confidence. And Arturo, I'm curious on your end on confidence, because you're someone who comes across as a very confident person.

5:15Where does your confidence come from and how do you share that with the rest of your team? Yeah, I mean, I think similar to Jose, it's like I think the power of leadership and you and I have spoken about this, Rob, is that in order to be a great leader, you have to be madly in love with yourself. And not in an arrogant way or a conceited way. You have to have such confidence that you have the power and the capacity to do the things that you believe you can do.

5:45That gives that will give everybody one piece of mind, knowing that they're with the right person. But it also gives you, I think, the strength and the guidance to actually begin to start coaching number two, number three, number four, number five. And so for me, it's, you know, I've also and I think, you know, I could probably say the same for you, Rob, that I think that, you know, some of us were born with with a good amount of confidence that you're inherently born that's in the fabric of your DNA.

6:15I also have, you know, I have plenty of examples and things that happened throughout my life with both of my parents, coaches, people that I've met that really have allowed me to really understand that if I train, if I practice, if I prepare and if I believe in myself and I love myself, then I will be the strongest version of myself. And that will allow me to push that onto other people.

6:40I love that. And the phrase that has become one of my favorite of the last two years, and certainly after doing the 75 hard mental toughness program and live hard is earned confidence that I earned my confidence by doing and experiencing things. And so often it's like, hey, how do you become more confident? Well, you become more confident the more that you do things, whether it's hard things, easy things, anything in general. It's about living in action and earning that confidence.

7:10So Arturo, I'll throw this over to you to jam with Jose. Yeah, man, I'd love to understand. I mean, listen, you know, diving into the to just the way that you speak, the way that you perceive the world, the way that you're coaching your fighters confidence. Obviously, we spoke about confidence. It's such a critical thing. Like, I'd love to understand where you're where your influences are coming from. You know, is it was it your mother, your your coaches?

7:37I mean, where did where did you where did all this come from? Yeah, that's another great question. But it is a combination of a lot of people, a lot of things, a lot of life experiences throughout my whole life being raised. I think what helped me become a good leader in my business and a good and good to my employees is that I been an employee that has been mistreated and underpaid and felt used before.

8:18And experiencing that helped me be like, I never want my team to feel what I felt for many years. And then that's what helped me in the business side. Also, with with boxing, I've had boxing coaches that made a big impact in my life. I've had my mother that I love very much. Single. I was raised by a single mother. So my mother was one of those people that I always wanted to to please.

8:48I never wanted to throw that away and ruin her pride and joy. So that right there was one of those one of the biggest influences, because any time that I had any any sort of question or doubt in doing something, I thought of my mother and what would she do and how she react to it. So a combination of all those things is really what made me be who I am and strong, just living through a lot of stuff like that throughout my whole life that made me be this person. A very caring person.

9:18I care to bring the best out of people because someone cared enough to see that in me and gave me that opportunity. Like Rob saw the podcast in me and now I'm now I'm doing it. My boxing coaches saw enough talent in me that they invested in me and coaching me. Someone offered me to coach when I was 16 years old and I started coaching at 16. And that really helped me because I started learning how to run a boxing class and things like that at the age of 16.

9:47When I was 19, I was running a smog shop, smogging cars at 19 years old. At 23 years old, someone saw the confidence in me to run a dealership, a service department in a dealership at 23 years old. So these are all opportunities people saw in me and believed in me and gave me the opportunity. And those are the opportunities that I wish to bring upon people and bring them out of them. And this because that's what someone did to me also.

10:17So that's what I mean, there's a combination of a lot of people, a lot of things. I love it. I love it. And this is mad respect. I mean, even again, just looking at yourself, reading yourself in a short period, 24-hour period, you can see that you have the softness of your soul and your heart that probably comes from your mother.

10:39But the rawness and toughness from being the singular male in an all-female household. Like having to be that guy for the ladies of the house requires that, hey, you got to, in whatever capacity, you got to protect. You got to protect honor. You got to protect physical. You got to protect everything. But you also share and it comes off is that you have this real softness and realness about being humble, being a nice person. Those are the things that I think that, you know, qualities certainly that I would say that I've been able to pick up from both of my parents. But certainly my mother. My mother was a big part of my upbringing as well. It's awesome. I love it. Yeah, man. Good question, Arturo. Thank you for asking that.

11:30So, Jose, I've got a question around mental toughness. So, I was fortunate enough when I lived in Orlando for one year, I didn't know a single person. So, I ended up heading to a boxing gym and taking boxing for a year. And it completely changed my perspective on the sport. And it was my first foray into mental toughness and something that I've learned to embrace and seek out.

11:58And I'm curious how you, one, train for mental toughness or two, how you help your fighters with it. Because when you're in a ring and things are tough, mental toughness is the thing that's going to separate those who are good from those who are great. So, can you talk a little bit more about the boxing DNA around mental toughness? Yes. Yes.

12:21Man, boxing is one of those sports, it's actually the only sport I believe that does everything during training that is not by the book. And what I mean by not by the book is, for example, if you're playing basketball, football, or anything, you do something where you're like, oh, it's bad for you if you don't eat or you're doing this or whatever it is that you're doing. It's bad for you because it is obviously it's not good for you.

12:50Boxing, you do a lot of stuff that is not good for you. Kind of like a Navy SEAL during Navy SEAL training where they, I've heard that they get drowned. They drown them and they got to bring them back to life. They do CPR and then they got to experience it. Obviously, that's not good for them. I mean, you're over here putting people in water. You know what I mean? Like that's obviously not good for them, but the experience is what you're getting from me.

13:17Is that's the mental toughness that you're pushing through that you're not going to get by going to college or doing something like that. You're not going to experience that. And that's what I do here at the gym. Like I do things where it is not going to be, it's not, it's not going to be comfortable. There's multiple scenarios, but the simple one that I'm going to explain to you is running.

13:42And, and one of the biggest things, if you ever heard this, but boxing, when you sign up to boxing, and what I mean by boxing is when you're competing in boxing to be a boxer, you're pretty much being a semi-professional runner. Because boxers run a sh*t ton a lot. Every day we run, we run three to four miles daily on top of our boxing training. Like running is a big part of boxing.

14:04And the reason behind that, besides the cardio, besides you losing the weight because you got to maintain a low weight, besides all the obvious things of running, the biggest part of it is the mental strength. When you feel like you cannot go, when your body's beat, you have shins flinched, your f*cking feet hurt, you may have plantar fasciitis, you may have this, you may have that, your knees hurt, your back hurts. Does not matter. You have to keep going. You keep going.

14:33And it doesn't matter if you run the day. And that day you happen to run a 10 minute pace because you have shin splints and back pain. But the point is you push through pain, push through pain. When someone else would have told you take the day off because you have plantar fasciitis at the boxing gym, I tell you, I don't give a f*ck. Put your running shoes and go run. Because that's what it comes down to.

14:57Because when you fight and you watch this in boxing, in boxers, they're fighting and somebody quits because he broke his hand or he broke his jaw. In boxing or any combat sport, it looks down upon him. It looks like you're not a fighter because you didn't fight through that. And people will be like, whoa, he's got another day. He's got more than fighting. Yes, I get it. But this is a sport that is not by the book. It's you're a fighter. You've got to fight through things.

15:27You're not a scientist. You know what I mean? You're a fighter. This is what makes you. So I test my boxers every day with things like this where I put you in an uncomfortable situation. And if you can't push through that, I tell them straight up, go play cookies. Go play cookies. Go do something else. Boxing is not for you if you can't push through a little bit of uncomfortable, a little bit of uncomfortableness. And yeah, that's it. I love that.

15:57It is such a unique skill, but one that is the gift that keeps on giving because of course, Jose, the reason that you're training them for that is so that once they get in the ring and when the lights are on and they are in that moment, once again, they've earned that confidence. They know all of that time they put in the reps and did the runs and did the things that they did not want to do.

16:24And that grit and mental toughness and mental strength is a separator when all things are equal. Yep. I agree. That's exactly how you earn your confidence. Very true. You know, nothing will break you. So ain't no person across the ring that's going to break somebody that pushed through all that training. Your mind is so confident at that point that it don't matter if you break my ribs and you break my arm, I'll kick your ass with one arm. I mean, you know what I mean?

16:53It does not matter. It does not matter because that's how strong my mind is. So yeah, very true. I love the, um, every, everything, again, everything that I read and that I saw and that I was like, you know, to kind of digesting it's all to me, it's all extremely applicable. 100% applicable in everything in a corporate space, in a business space. You know, Rob and I spoke about, you know, get comfortable being uncomfortable.

17:24That if you really want to make something of yourself in this life, whether it's in a sport, whether if it's in a career, whether if it's as an entrepreneur, whether it's whatever it is, if you do not get to a point where you have to be accustomed to being very uncomfortable, you're not going to survive. You're not going to survive. You, you won't make the impact that you want to make. So, you know, I guess one of the, one of the next questions I saw, there was a post from five days ago.

17:52It was, um, where you mentioned you, you call out one of the boxers and you're like, Hey, cabron, you're like, you're, you know, you're not, you're not, you're not hitting enough. You're not, you're not moving enough. And, and then in the, in the actual text, you write that, you know, you have to give your boxer, you have to tell your boxer in a minute, you have to tell them the good, the bad and the ugly. And that's, that is the, the priority for a coach in the corner to be able to make adjustments really quick.

18:20Like funny things like Rob and I've had a bunch of conversations that about the impact of that just on leadership and on coaching that you, that these real time spurts, these real time feedbacks, whether it's in boxing or in business that it's super impactful. And so the question is, tell me a little bit more about that quality, that characteristic.

18:47And, and does that apply to the way that you manage your employees on the business side as well? Yes. Uh, Arturo, it's actually very parallel how you said it. And this, and, uh, something that I created here at the gym, I do something where I created a 10 stage warrior program for my boxers to go through similar to mixed martial arts.

19:08And the reason why I'm bringing this up is, um, everything that you, I've learned in boxing made me be that much greater as a human, but as an entrepreneur, because there's nothing that phases me. If, if my whole staff quit on me in my head, I know I can still, I'll figure this sh*t out like this. I don't care what happens. If they make me close for a year, I'll figure that sh*t out. There's nothing in my mind that will phase my business.

19:38And that I got from boxing because I learned that through boxing and I'm thankful for that because of boxing. So back to your question is I do very well train my boxers, uh, that way, because I tell them if you get this, and it doesn't matter if you don't become a world champion, but if you get anything out of boxing, when you leave these doors. Is I just hope you leave with a boxers mentality.

20:03And that you have that strength and confidence in your mind that you can tackle this and whatever you can take this and tackle whatever obstacle comes in your life later on, because you learned to hear. And I teach the same thing and I talk about the same stuff with my staff. I tell them the same thing. Um, and you know, the, one of the things that make it easier for me to tell my staff that is because my entire staff one by one all started as a member at the gym competed here. And then down the road became part of the part of the staff, literally everyone on my staff, except one of my coaches that him and I grew up together boxing.

20:45He's the only one that did not start as a member, but everybody else started as a member first. And then from there became, uh, what they are doing now at the gym. And, and a funny note, let me, let me tell you guys this. So throughout my warrior program, the ones that are very coachable and they're very multiple and listen very well when they're coaching.

21:07Uh, when I'm coaching them as boxers, this is what helps me see, do I, what, do I really want to have this person on my staff? Because I've noticed all the ones that were uncoachable during boxing were uncoachable during, as a staff member. They're identical. And that's what made it so easy for me to transfer from here to there, because it's the same thing.

21:31It's literally the same thing is the people have the same core values and they have the same, regardless if it's during a workout or during work. And they're still the same person, um, and they're going to, and they're going to, uh, react in the same way. So, yeah. I love it. You know what? I'm there's, there's, there's now this analogy that I'm going to use because here's the thing is in for me in the past, or even now when I'm coaching employees again, I let people know, even when I'm hiring, I'm going to let them know, listen, you're going to hear, you're going to hear a lot from me. I'm going to tell you if you're doing something fantastic, I'm going to grab you and I'm going to let you know, I'm not going to wait. I'm not going to tell you the next day. I'm not going to send you a card.

22:14I'm going to tell you right then when I see you on the same, on the same note, if I see you do something wrong, I'm going to let you know, I'm going to correct that action. But the reality is like, people aren't going to get their head knocked off or their teeth knocked out. If I don't tell them in the corporate side, if you, if you don't tell somebody how to adjust quick and what they're doing bad and Hey man, you got him. He's moving this way. Get them. Keep pushing on that. Keep pushing on that. Focusing on the good.

22:44That's what wins fights. That's what wins fights. And so it's, it's the analogy to me now is like, I can, I can share and help people understand a little bit better and say, listen, you will get infinitely stronger if you're open-minded to getting feedback from me real time. Yep. 100%. We might, we might survive the fight. Yep.

23:09I actually heard one, um, a, it kind of reminds me of it right now, but I think I saw it on Instagram or something, but it said, uh, uncoachable kids become, un, uh, uncoachable, um, uh, employees or un, you can't work. They become bad employees if they weren't uncoachable as kids, which is in a way I see 100% true because a lot.

23:36It has to do with how you're raised and how you're brought up. You just reminded me of that Arturo song. I had to throw that in there, but that is true. So Jose, last question I have for you is around self chatter. So we've talked so much about the mental side of things, because I believe the mental side of things is the biggest game changer of them all. I look back at my entrepreneurial journey.

24:03And when I realized self-awareness and everything was on me, I was like, all right, well, I can control my mindset and I can control how much I learn. And no one can ever take that away from me. So let's talk about self chatter because it can be either the biggest blessing or the biggest curse for people. It's something that all of us face on a daily basis because life is more like a roller coaster than it is linear.

24:30Just everything once again, it's not puppy dogs and rainbows. And I'm curious, we talked about confidence. We talked about mental toughness. How do you teach or how do you think about self chatter and controlling your thoughts? Also knowing that many of your students are going to go out outside of your gym and not have you right there talking to them 24 hours a day. You asking me, how do I handle that? Or do I let it affect me?

24:59Well, it can be either one. One, how do you handle that or coach that? Because it is such an important thing on what we are saying to ourselves because it's always present. Yeah. So one thing I tell my kids and actually all my boxers, I tell them this. When they're training, there's times where they're alone. Meaning by alone is they may be running alone. They may be hitting the bag alone. They may be doing something, but they're alone.

25:27And the alone meaning they don't have me right there telling them, all right, go. One more. All right, let's do this. Because they act different when I'm there cheering them on and when I'm not there. And I tell them, if you can only run a six-minute mile, a seven-minute mile, but you can only do that when I'm there, and you can't do that when I'm not there's a problem.

25:51Because now, when you go to the real world, that means you're only going to do things good if coach is there. And if coach is not there, you're not going to do it there. And that's not good because coach is not always going to be there. So you got to have that. And I tell them like that, same conversation I'm having with you guys right now. I tell them stuff like that. You got to learn to create that self-discipline within yourself that you have to stay away from certain things, certain people.

26:17And you have to make that decision on your own, not because coach told you. You have to want to do that. And I can tell who's serious and who takes it serious because I can tell when I'm not looking at them how they work. And if they're working hard when I'm not looking at them, they're making the right decisions when I'm not looking at them too. I love that. Arturo, I'll allow you to wrap this up with another question. Okay.

26:45I mean, I have about 40 more questions, but this is one that I think is going to be valid for all of us and pretty important. And so, I mean, you got a lot of personalities, a lot of different kids coming into that gym. I see white girls. I see white guys. I see brown kids. I see black kids.

27:03And so from all walks of life, one of the things a great coach has the ability to do is understanding who they need to be to be able to connect with that person. So rather than saying, I'm going to be this person and I'm going to leave that kid over there in the corner. And if he doesn't want to conform to who I am and what this is, then he's going to stay over there.

27:30But one of the things that I've learned over my life in terms of leadership is that sometimes I have to give myself. I have to give myself and also become subordinate almost, become subordinate almost to allow that entry point. And so I'd love to understand because I can see it. I know it. I see all the stuff that you're doing and I see these different kids that you're coaching.

27:55All of them end up getting this crazy, this crazy momentum, this coaching, this instruction from you. But not all these kids are the same. So tell me a little bit about that. Yeah, it's definitely the way it started is I used to, like I said, when I was boxing, I would I've actually was able to experience a lot of different trainers, a lot of different boxing gyms.

28:18And I noticed growing up that if you were to serve boxing coach, all their other boxers look at and box the same. And I always find it curious. It was I always I was always interested that that why is it that they're all identical? And it's very that I find it interesting that each of those trainers only had two, three, four boxers. They didn't have a lot of them.

28:47And the reason behind that is because they weren't not able to connect to that many people because they were so close minded that they could only get to a handful versus a whole bunch. And that kind of sparked interest in me. And that's kind of what lit the light bulb for me. And then when I was at the dealership and then when I started working on cars, I noticed that I actually went to a sales.

29:11I went to a sales like training where they talked about what you have to do to to make better sales and things like that. And one of the things they mentioned, they said, you have to ask questions. You got to talk to your clients, see what they need. And then once you do that, you respond with making sure they know they got the right guy. They hired the right place for their needs.

29:39Once you know that, you know what you have to provide to make this person happy. So that kind of connected another dot for me. A guy that couldn't close, couldn't reach a lot of people. And then a person that is out here pleasing people by asking questions. So then when I started coaching, I started remembering these things that I went through in life and I started paying attention to that.

30:00And I said, me as a coach, I have to look at the person that I have here and see what they are going through by asking questions, talking to them, seeing what they're good at and making them better at that and then seeing what their weaknesses are and helping them become stronger in their weak spots. And what I started doing is I started paying attention to each one of those members that came by. Are they here because they're just depressed?

30:30Are they here because they're whatever it is that they need? And I just fulfilled that need for them. And I did that with my boxers, too. If they're tall and lanky, I made sure that when we fought, we fought long, tall. If they were short, we showed them how to fight on the inside. If they had good stamina, we showed how to apply pressure, high tempo.

30:55If they had strength, power, whatever it is, I built around their strength. I didn't build around what I wanted because it wasn't me. It was them. And at the end of the day, I'm here for them. And that's the way I looked at it. Hallelujah. I love it, man. That's amazing. That's exactly why you're successful. And that's why, and again, just from quick snippets of looking at your life and how I perceive it, I'm like, man, this guy is connecting with so many different people. And the only way to do that is to be able to have this ability to convert. It's almost like chameleon leadership and understanding that you have to be a little bit different to certain people to be able to get the most out of them. Yeah.

31:47I love it. Yeah. Thank you, Arturo, for that question. You guys have great questions. Well, Jose, thank you for coming on. We like to wrap up every episode by giving an action item or a takeaway. It's something that we can ask the audience to do something or, hey, something really resonated with us. And I'll get this party started, and my action item is around getting comfortable being uncomfortable.

32:14It is something that, by design, people do not want to do. So my action item is today and or this week or all of this month, design discomfort into what you do once a day. Do something that pushes you. And here's a simple example of what I do. I take some semblance of a cold shower every single day. And why in the world do I do it?

32:40Because 100 times out of 100, when I turn that water to freezing cold, it is cold and it sucks. But I like to think of it as micro doses of courage and mental toughness. So I seek it out. And when I'm about to do it, I don't allow my bitch voice to come and say, Rob, don't do it. I use it and I think of myself like a lion who's just roaring. Boom. I see that adversity and that mental toughness, and I seek that out. So that is my action item.

33:10Seek out something. It doesn't have to be massive. It can be something small. Seek out that discomfort in the name of mental toughness. And Arturo, throw this over to you next. Yeah. I mean, my takeaway is going to be the, is just that people should really understand the power of immediate feedback. Whether it's going to surprise somebody because it's new to them or it's going to empower them.

33:36That type of feedback as shown by Jose and like, you know, being a coach in the ring can be a matter of life and death for your business. I love it. And Jose, let's throw this over to you. Do you have an action item or a takeaway? Action item or a takeaway? I would say action item. I'm going to start with action item.

34:02Something that I would say you guys should, whoever's listening to this, applies something where you're going to build your confidence. And what, something that will help you with building your confidence is the people around you. If the people around you are all constantly talking bad about you and little bad stuff, it doesn't even have to be that serious. It's just negative thoughts towards your way. Friends, family, whoever it may be, slowly get away further and further from that.

34:32And slowly and slowly get by people that are positive. Even if they don't say positive things to you yet, start changing who you spend your free time with more. Because that is the first step to building your confidence. Because you've got to be feeding yourself with good things. So that's my action for you guys. And hopefully you guys could take that and change your circle. I absolutely love that. And to yes and that.

34:58A simple thing you can do is you don't have to let someone know that I'm not going to be kicking it or hanging out with you. You can make it like a silent, slow burn where it's just not part of who you are and what you do. So someone might not even realize that you're distancing yourself from them. As opposed to having to go up to every person you think is negative and say, Hey, what's up? I'm no longer doing this with you. Boom. Just changing. I love what you said right there.

35:27So Jose, where can everybody connect with you? The easiest one is probably Instagram. I actually don't have anything else. It's just Instagram or my email. But Instagram is easiest one. It's L underscore Ray underscore De underscore Sacra, which is the king of Sacramento. It's E-L underscore R-E-Y underscore D-E underscore S-A-C-R-A. And hit me up on there. El Rey de Sacra. And I'm always responding. I'm very responsive. I love talking to people, as you can tell. I'm a people person. So anything I could ever do to maybe feed your confidence or something, I'm there for you. Well, in the interest of real-time feedback, Jose, I've got real-time feedback for you. Because you are leaving something on the table, my friend. Remember how we started this podcast? You said, Rob, thank you very much for helping me with launching my podcast.

36:27Guess what is another way that people can connect with you and get a dose on a regular basis of Jose Morales? By listening to your podcast. So moving forward, every time you're doing an interview, I don't want you to just say your Instagram. I want you to also let people know where they can listen to your podcast. So, Jose, where can everybody listen to your podcast and what is it called? Okay. That's what I'm talking about, Rob. I forget to mention that.

36:55The podcast is called the Jose Morales Podcast. That's simple. I'm actually having season two drop in a couple weeks. So I'm about – I did a full 80 episodes last season, and now I'm back on season two. And it's a great – man, it's just – you get better with time like everything. At the beginning, I was trying to figure out where my vibe was going to be, who I am.

37:20And now I've kind of started feeling myself and feeling what people like and things like that. And it's great. Just like I bring all sorts of people to come by, talk to us, females, males, successful, non-successful, everybody that had all these battles. And you're hearing all these things, most of them that I got from here from the gym. And it's just a great way to start your Monday because we drop every Monday a new episode.

37:48And it's just a good way to just listen to something to have a killer week. And it's with that Jose Morales Podcast, baby. It's on Apple Podcasts, and it's on Spotify, on YouTube. And, yep, that is it. Boom. I love that, Jose. I can feel the passion in that. That's why I want to hear more of that from you.

Transcript cleaned up for reading. Sign-off trimmed.

0:02Welcome to Leadership DNA, a podcast for those who aspire to be a better leader. Alongside Arturo Gomez, I'm Rob Cressy. Today's topic, Leadership Lessons from Coach Prime, Deion Sanders. Arturo, Deion Sanders is the talk of the college football world right now for what he's doing as head coach at Colorado. As we record on Thursday, September 21st, his team is 3-0. They went from unranked to 19th in the nation. And his method for how he's leading and created and transformed this team so quickly is a masterclass in culture and leadership. And what we're going to do is unpack this. So Arturo, what stands out to you the most or first about Coach Prime?

0:53I mean, there's so much there, man. This is, you know, the fact that we get to talk about leadership and college football and what like that's okay. That's my, that's my dream conversation here that we're having today. So it's just, it's fascinating. I mean, watching him is, will I think become a case study. And, you know, to a lot of people, I think there was, there was a tremendous amount of brashness and maybe to some people there still is.

1:18I think the guy is incredibly honest. And I think some of the things that he's done right out of the gate have fascinated me because, you know, through his honesty, he really used, you know, use the transfer portal to kind of clear the entire bench of that, of that team. But, but with the honesty proposition of telling people that if they're not prepared to fight and they're not prepared to actually show that they have real value to bring to the team, that they should leave.

1:52And, you know, honestly, there's been, there's other stories of executives and business owners and leaders and military, you know, scenarios that similar situations have happened. And it either, it either is a motivating factor for those that want to stay, or it's a complete signal to the rest of the people that they should be leaving. But, you know, there's, there's a lot going on in every conversation that he's having with the media and any glimpse that you get to see into that locker room, you're seeing, you know, this guy is, he's bringing, you know, the, the amount of manifesting and the amount of visioning that he's doing with his team is over the top. I mean, he's got these kids believing that they're going to win the national championship. And by the way, they, they very well might, you know, it's, it's one of those, years right now that I'm sensing in college football, that it's like, it's anybody, it's, it's open right now for anybody to take the, take the challenge. And you know what, this guy's built a team of incredible student athletes. And I think it's, it's going to be sky's the limit. And every week I can tell you that the entire country is going to be focused on watching this guy coach and watching what the output of his, is of his team.

3:14Yeah. So let's formulaically break some of this down. So when you're talking about what Deion Sanders did at the very beginning, Colorado was one of, if not the worst college football teams in the nation last year. So Deion Sanders, he's not only a winner, he's a hall of famer and he is like a hall of famer of hall of famers. He is, he has a different wing as he likes to say. He's like, not everybody's like me.

3:40He is best of the best. So he brings a culture of winning to everything that he does. So when he came to Colorado, which has a culture of losing, he's like, I'm not about this life. I don't want this permeating what I'm doing. And to me, it was very similar, or we can take some corollaries to what Elon Musk did when he bought Twitter, where all of a sudden, boom, he's like, listen, 90% of you aren't going to be here.

4:09And he trimmed the fat and Deion Sanders did the same. And one of the things that I found so interesting is that Deion Sanders, and I'm paraphrasing here said, culture doesn't matter. And so many of the skeptics out there said, there's no way this guy can be successful building an entire program all around the transfer portal because it's a bunch of disparate parts and there is no culture whatsoever.

4:35And Deion even says that. But the truth of the matter is there a better culture right now than what Colorado is building? Because what, well, maybe not the best because you've got the Georgias and the Alabamas of the world who have this long lineage of winning, but this quickly. And what he did is he removed instantly all of the friction, the resistance, and he changed who we are and how we do things immediately.

5:02And when I look at professional sports, there are so many organizations that can't get out of their own ways. The Cleveland Browns are a phenomenal example of this. They're a team from a culture standpoint. I think a lot of people would also say the New York Jets, where you look at the things that they do and things just don't seem to work out for them. There's a culture or a stink that just sort of permeates.

5:27And it's not necessarily just the players. As we both know, Arturo, leadership starts at the top and everything else permeates that organization. And Coach Prime went in here and Colorado had to put some money on the line that they didn't have. I believe it was like $25 million. Their boosters raised it. And all of a sudden, Colorado, not only are they must watch from a football standpoint, but their program is on the map.

5:55Their boosters, it's like a celebrity event now. And to me, this is such a wise way for a leader to come in and create a culture of excellence just like this. Yes. You know, listen, man, he you know, I think one of the things with him is that he's he he's done it like, you know, he's asking these athletes to do certain things that the only person that really could ever ask them to do the things that he's asking them to do would be somebody that that has done what Deion has done. And so, you know, we've you know, I think it was in our last one of our last episodes. We talk about, you know, walking the walk and leading by example.

6:37And so he's able to really come with a tremendous amount of confidence because, you know, if you ever had a chance to see Deion Sanders play when he was in his prime, there really wasn't many better. There was very few athletes on the planet that really could compare to him. And, you know, he still has that same confidence that he had when he was playing as as a you know, as a two sport professional athlete.

7:04And, you know, I think that that's that's one of the that's one of the main reasons I think that, you know, he granted he assembled a tremendous cast of talented athletes for, you know, this new this new face, this new remake of Colorado football. But his his confidence and the things that he's pushing these athletes to do and the things that he's asking them to do, all these kids know that he's asking because he's done it.

7:31And they have such faith that that he's created this this vision and this path for them that really is there. They're not stopping until they get to the top. And so it's it's it's pretty remarkable to see on a weekly basis. So one of the things that you talked about is belief and what he is doing of transferring his energy, his knowledge, his belief, his level of excellence and execution to his team.

8:00And it's an interesting thing, because just because you're the loudest coach doesn't mean that your team is immediately going to succeed because there's a large sample size of coaches who yell. There's players, coaches. There's quiet coaches. There's all sorts of ways right there. But Deion is doing this in a way that is very on brand for the way that our current landscape is.

8:27Things are changing in the world right now from the pandemic to AI to the world of the way that NCAA and the conference realignments and the transfer portal. Everything is differently. And there's going to be a group of people or schools or coaches that are going to say this is the way that things are always done or that we've always done them.

8:51And a lot of the world in all industries are going to get passed by by the Deion Sanders of the world. And quite frankly, it's why on my end, I'm all in on AI and leading from my perspective with my clients and the companies that I'm working with on ways that we can leverage these things to do more with less faster, to solve our problems faster.

9:16And Deion Sanders did such a good job of solving a problem faster than anybody else did in a way that the system wasn't supposed to be designed for this. But he went in there as a leader and says, all right, I'm going to leverage the transfer portal in a way that nobody else ever has. And I'm going to use the assets that I have to myself in my ability as a leader to elevate everybody else around me.

9:45And to me, that is such an important part of this is his ability to lead these men. And one of the things that stands out to me and people ask Deion, are you immediately going to go to the NFL? And once again, paraphrasing, essentially what he said is, I feel like college football is my gospel. He is making men.

10:07And there's a very big difference in the framing of we are just a football factory versus the way that he is instilling lifelong lessons and fundamentals and ways of showing up as men for their families present and in the future. And to me, this is leadership 101. It goes beyond the football field, but it actually elevates the football field by getting to the root of who these people are in making them better.

10:38Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's, you know, you hear some of these sound bites of some of the things that he's saying and it's, listen, if I was a, if I was a student athlete that, you know, had the capacity to go play on a team like that, I'd want to go play for a guy like that. You know, and, you know, it's not, you can, you can tell by the way that he's presenting himself, that he's believable in every, in everything that he's saying.

11:02And to consume some of those sound bites and some of those, some of those words that have come out of his mouth that he's, he really, he cares about winning obviously deeply, but he cares more about developing these kids into productive contributors to society to, so that they become great fathers. They become great brothers. They become great teammates.

11:25And that's, that is, you know, that's, that's one of those critical pieces of leadership when, you know, when that leader is so focused on making sure that every one of those individuals becomes better. I mean, that's, that's one of the, that's one of the foundations of, you know, when you're in the presence of a true leader, that they are solely focused, not necessarily on just the accomplishment and on winning, but they're really focused on the development and the progress of the individuals that they're leading.

11:53And so I think it's, it's, it's, it's fantastic. But you know, the other thing is that you can tell that his beliefs and his convictions, they're so deep. They're, they're incredibly deep in the way that he's bringing this stuff forward that, you know, that's, it's a critical part of, you know, transcendental leadership. It's like, when you're really able to change things as quickly as he's done it, there has to be a belief system and there has to be convictions that, you know, are a hundred percent. There can be no wavering. Everybody on that team needs to a hundred percent believe that they're going to be the best. So Arturo immediately, when you're saying that my mind goes to cool. We as leaders would be wise to audit our own systems.

12:41What is the system that we have in place for developing our team members, not just in what we're doing in business, but holistically in life. And then number two, you also talk about a belief system in so much of workplace culture can just be work, work, work. And I've talked about this over the years on this show where it blew my mind as I grew in my leadership and personal growth journey that I went the first 32 years of my life without someone ever saying the term self-awareness to me. That no one had invested in their personal development or growth systemically to then pass that along to me.

13:28And it blows my mind that some of these things aren't taught in terms of why is there not a curriculum around personal growth and development at every single company? Because I think about the clients that I've worked with and even my very first, uh, coaching client where I didn't even have a website and I wasn't even a coach. Just a CEO saw the way that I lived on Instagram and said, Rob, will you help make my team better at business by being better at life?

13:57I was like, of course I've lived this way for more than a decade. So that's how I stepped into being a coach. And the results we received over the months were transformational. And of course their business elevated when their employees were happier, they're better equipped to deal with divert or adversity. And I can tell you, uh, Colorado, the chances of them going undefeated, it would be amazing if they do, but adversity is going to strike them.

14:26I know, I believe Travis Hunter, one of their star players is injured right now. And there's no way Deion's going to say, listen, everyone, there's a reason why we can lose now. No, we all get to elevate ourselves right now. So I would encourage everyone to ask themselves, what is your way or system that you are developing everybody else around you? I'm curious your thoughts on this Arturo. I mean, yeah, that's, that's always going to be the challenge.

14:54I mean, I think it's, it goes to, you know, it's personal energy, personal management. Um, you know, the belief of the team in terms of capabilities is only going to, sometimes going to only go as far as the leader. And so that's the critical importance of, you know, bringing real energy, real vision, you know, real enthusiasm to, uh, you know, to these opportunities when you get, when you're in front of your team to be able to coach. But, um, I think that's, to me, that's what it is. I mean, you take that same team and you remove Deion in a few weeks time, you're going to have a real problem.

15:35Uh, that team is not going to be necessarily, uh, as productive, uh, self-managed, you know, they're gravitating toward this, towards this, you know, individual who's incredibly charismatic, incredibly charismatic. And he's got a plan. It's, you know, he's got a plan. He's prepared. He's bringing the energy. He's bringing the confidence. And, um, you know, and so some of those things are a little bit more difficult to put on paper, to put a process behind because it's, it's really down to the human level. So, you know, it's like, is there, is there process around it? Yeah, we got to be really prepared. We have to have systems. We have to have process. Um, you know, all that stuff helps create some redundancies. It creates some opportunities to, you know, reinforce the system.

16:24But, you know, a lot of, a lot of, uh, you know, leadership or a lot of success within the team environment is really dependent on, you know, the individual that's there. And it's, and listen, he's, he's shown tremendously, like what bringing a true leader into a situation can do. Put aside his tactics of how he's actually, how he's gotten there and bringing in the transfer portal and stuff like that.

16:48You know, I've, I've been, I've been, you know, I've been a part of in the past where situations where, you know, whether I was brought in or I had to step away for a minute, you know, and there's, there's times where that vacuum of leadership has a real, uh, real negative effect. So my recommendation is to, yes, make sure that there are systems in process in place, but, um, you know, make sure that there's succession.

17:13You know, if you can, if you can find other teammates in the organization that you think are going to have the same vision or that are going to be able to bring that same energy and charisma to the table. Um, I think that's a better, uh, way to maybe safeguard the continued success of a team is making sure that there's always a number two that's there and ready to kind of step in, in those types of situations. Yeah. And, and one of the things that I'm hearing what you're talking about becomes time horizon.

17:42And I think that's one of the things that's been so impressive about this is how quickly he's been able to not only establish his culture of excellence, but the way that they do that, because I know in my own growth journey or for anyone, it's more like cooking a chili where it takes some time and you let that simmer and things are marinating and building on top of each other. So yeah, maybe Colorado over four years or a decade could get to this point.

18:11And instead, boom, it's like right out of the gate, they beat TCU, a team that was in the national championship game. It's like, how did this happen? Which is almost like shooting lightning in them. And as you're talking about the transfer of energy to the number twos as leaders, we would love to be able to pour ourself out of a situation. And Deion's doing this, but for a lifelong horizon of, I'm going to turn these football players into men.

18:40And that's, what's so interesting about this is he's planting the long-term seeds, but there's having, but they're having micro success right out of the gate. And by design, personal growth and development and leadership is something that is typically a longer term process. And to see this happening so quickly, you would hope that this belief is elevating other leaders to levels they didn't even know were possible for themselves.

19:07To where they can then, even without Deion, be the ones who rise up to the rest of their team. Because we see this in college football all the time that if you remove the head coach, oftentimes you're in big trouble if he's the entire system. As opposed to, is your machine so good that it can run without you? Maybe the standard's not going to be as high, but still a certain level of excellence. Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent.

19:36I mean, that's the, this succession kind of redundancy. I mean, listen, the real teams that have success, whether it's in the corporate space or on the athletic fields. It's, it's obviously Deion is a, is a extremely powerful singular piece, but the people that have real success, there's, there's a team around those individuals. And, um, you know, they mentioned it, I think it was the 60 minutes, um, uh, you know, a piece that they did on him last week, actually, that he, in addition to being able to bring tremendous athletes through the transfer portal to Colorado. He also brought a ton of coaches with him. You know, he brought some of the, you know, some guys that, you know, he pulled some people out of Alabama. He pulled some people from, you know, really from all over the place.

20:26And again, it was an assembly of, uh, a cast of leaders that he needed to fulfill this mission. But, you know, and so I think it's, uh, it's, you know, to the, to this, you know, concept of, you know, how do we continue this type of pace or safeguard ourselves from kind of falling behind? You got to make sure that there's people within the system that, uh, believe in that can, uh, continue to help support the process because there's not one person that can, that can maintain that type of consistency and energy all the time without people around them to help. 100%. 100%. So now time for our action item or takeaway.

21:07And for me, the action item is all around auditing your personal growth and development systems, the ways that you are making your team better. Are you doing anything on top of just the work or business side of things? Do you have a repeatable system to build leaders within your organization that will help them like Deion's doing, making them better men and women holistically for their entire life? Arturo, what about you? What's your action item or takeaway? So my action item is there's two things. One, I want, uh, people that are really interested in trying to understand a little bit more about why we're calling this a case study.

21:51Go on Google and just look up Deion Sanders and his leadership like sound bites. It's, there's already, you can already see that tons of people are searching it because it populates immediately. So I think you're going to find there's, there's this guy, even though he's, he's got this confidence level that he's bringing some real truths, but there's, there's so much good stuff that he's already dropped that you can pick up.

22:21And then the other thing I would tell you is to watch Colorado play this Saturday, watch Colorado play this Saturday, because what we're, what we're witnessing, I'm telling you is it's going to, this is, this is kind of history in the making. And from a lot of regards, I think there's people that may not even like college football that are taking note to what this guy has been able to do. And I think it's, I think it's fascinating.

22:46And I think every week that goes by is going to be a little piece of history. One hundred percent. And Arturo, one of the fun things about us recreating this podcast and getting the party started again is we have decided to invest in a few things. One, creating micro content from our episodes where you chop out little 60 second magic moments or vignettes that we publish in our leadership DNA LinkedIn group or page, I guess you would say. And we are getting a ton of engagement specifically with your community, Arturo, the people who are saying, I love Arturo's perspectives. I want more of them.

23:31And it makes me smile seeing this because I'm seeing the way that others view you as a leader from the outside. And even though this is brand new for us, and I think as of right now, I don't even know if we have a hundred people in the page, but that's okay because this is an organic thing that we're doing to give back to others. And this is sort of a overt, if you're not following the leadership DNA LinkedIn page, we would love for you to follow it and interact with us.

24:00And then number two, Arturo, I'm curious on your thoughts on what you're seeing from the group because we're posting anywhere from three to four pieces of content from each episode and people are legitimately engaging in a large amount of them. Yeah, no, listen, man, it's fascinating. I'm really happy. I think you and I are both speaking from the heart and from passion, and we are genuinely very interested in this subject.

24:30And if it's creating some additional dialogue and conversation, I love it. And the fact that if people value some of the things that I've said, hopefully it helps. Hopefully it helps. And we're going to keep doing it. And, you know, we just hope that people continue to get some value from it. Yeah, 100%. And my suggestion would be is if you have not connected with myself or Arturo on LinkedIn, please do so.

24:59Send us an invite. Drop a mention that you listen to the Leadership DNA podcast because we would love to be able to help you on your journey. Because one of the beautiful things is this is a network. We do build relationships. We are looking to find ways to work with people, partner, collaborate, introduce people to each other, whatever it is. This is an open forum for us. We just want to help you.

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